Who will manage the smart grid?

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Speaker: Well, this brings up the question. We've been hearing a lot about smart grid and things like that, and it's going to offer a way for consumers to monitor their electricity consumption, for example, and become more energy efficient. We've also heard about how utilities can use that to help with demand response and reducing the load on their peak power plants. I'm just curious where the balance of power is going to take place. Are building owners going to be able to optimize around energy efficiency, or is it going to be utilities that optimize around loading their plants?

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Speaker: It's interesting. There's the -- I have -- my personal philosophy is, is that it's gonna end up on the supply side, and it's gonna end up with utilities because the regulatory bodies are used to doing air resources boards, and there's an existing government entity that knows how to do that. I think it's on the wrong side. I think it ought to be on the demand side. It's closer to reality. It's simpler. It physically, just as in shifting carbon around is reducing carbon. So where it's gonna end up I think, personally, is in the wrong place. But I wouldn't put money it's gonna be on the demand side. I think that it'll be more on the regulatory side because the government knows what to do. There's existing entities to do it. That's just my personal opinion. Where the utilities will take advantage of the carbon side, where -- and the homeowners will see the reduction in their utility rate. And I don't think landlords are gonna get it, and I don't think tenants are gonna get it. I think it'll be on the other side. That's my opinion. I don't know, understand.

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Speaker: My bet in the -- in commercial, I'm with you. On the residential space, just because of how -- how diverse the number of buildings were talking about. I think, like, 13.2 million building -- residential buildings just in California. I think that long-term, it's gonna be 15-minute incremental rate changes and the ability to control loads inside your own house. There's also a limit of how far the utilities could reach into individual homes. But I'm with you on the commercial side where it's a lot easier to control the buildings.

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Speaker: I mean, it won't price drive all, though, because I mean, a year ago this time, you know, oil was kind of pushing $140.00 a barrel. It went way down; now it's going back up. But I mean people were -- you could give away a large SUV with a V8.

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Speaker: But that was last year.

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Speaker: That was last year. And all kinds of people were coming up with -- and I guess I would make the case that in a large part, energy -- resource consumption in the built environment is going to be similar. I think, particularly for residential. Commercial, you know, round numbers, salaries are $100.00 a square foot; utilities are a couple dollars a square foot. So it's hard to get the same level of urgency, I think, in a commercial building. I -- I wish it was different, but --

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Speaker: Right.

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Speaker: I think the market will drive it. I think it's the supply and the demand. It's the competitive nature of business. It's the my building's better than your building kind of a concept. And I think that's going to be the key. Competitive pressures more than the price of energy, and carbon, I think, will ultimately drive that new building. I think the existing buildings, it's gonna take either government, or it's gonna take a real estate transaction. You know, it's gonna be the folks at Stanford and Hoss, and those places, who are physically gonna drive the market change and change the conversation because of legislative and competitive pressures.

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Speaker: I have to say, I think that feedback is a benefit. Certainly -- probably the people who already benefited the most will still benefit the most, but I think that gives the opportunity for transparency and behavior change. So individuals can at least have an understanding of what their behaviors mean. And whether you're talking about an individual home owner, or, you know, the kid who leaves his computer and his phone charger on his room and his parents get mad. I mean, whatever scale you're talking about, it's a benefit to at least be able to observe what is the result of a behavior. And when you factor in the time of use considerations, it becomes more -- it's a more interesting game to play. And, in fact, the Title 24 that goes into effect the first of August, that's part of that game because the weights are shifting, and penalties for consumption at peak load times show up in title 24. That is code, so that -- I mean that will affect behavior.

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Speaker: Only if there's net tenant metering.

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Speaker: I think only if the user pays for it individually.

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Speaker: Well, no, it affects your ability to meet code because you have to demonstrate your behaviors in your code submission, so it's calculated. Its -- I mean, in terms of acclimating-

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Speaker: The existing product versus new, yeah.

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Speaker: Yeah -- well for new buildings, the way that it works. You know, you build a -- that this is a prescriptive versus performance based. But current codes, as far as energy goes, are set up that you can either follow the rules or comply. Or you can prove that you achieve at a certain performance level. And so , the way you do that is you say, "Okay, if I build a Joe average building that just complies with the code, this is what it would be. And here's how I've done it. I did a different mix. I put in better windows. I -- you know, I put in less insulation because I wanted more window, but they're better windows. What ever your math is, but you have to prove that you achieved the overall goal. So that is our Energy Code. That is a requirement for in your buildings.

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==== Transcribed by Automatic Sync Technologies ====