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As cosmetics chain Lush scoops an RSPCA award for the second year running, we spoke to the firm's director of ethics, Hilary Jones, about animal testing, organic ingredients and that 'unique' Lush smell.
SmartPlanet: Where does Lush stand on animal-tested products?
Hilary Jones: The main objection we have with the Humane Cosmetic Standard, which other cruelty-free companies adhere to, is that it focuses on ingredients. So if I was an animal-testing company and you were a cruelty-free company that wanted to buy glycerine off me, you’d ask whether I’d tested the glycerine -- whereas Lush asks whether they test anything [on animals], so we don’t want them testing even the ingredients that we’re not buying. It’s like a consumer boycott.
SP: Your site refers to the REACH chemical testing legislation, but in terms of animal testing. Why is that?
HJ: This legislation is one of the things that it would be really nice to be able to support -- to get long-term-use chemicals tested to see what the effects are. Unfortunately, the legislation as it stands means that the majority of these tests are going to be conducted on animals, and to us that’s one step forward and one step back. We’ve also got a petition in our stores at the moment about the EU directive [86/609] -- the legislation that controls all animal testing in Europe.
The law says that where an alternative to animal testing exists you should use it, but currently there is no database of alternatives. What we’re asking for is a central database and also stronger support from the testing industry, so that they’re forced to contribute money towards the validation of non-animal tests because it’s so slow getting them through.
SP: How much time is spent actually sourcing the ingredients?
HJ: Phenomenal amounts of time. We try to have a real understanding of the ingredient, and the only way we can do that is to go out and meet the people that make it. Then we can see what the working conditions are and understand why the price is that price -- but that’s not fool-proof either, because we can’t visit every year and people can put on a good show for a couple of days. Our buying team is only half a dozen people, but they’re out of the country constantly.
Just this year they’ve visited the Atlas Mountains, they’ve visited cocoa plantations in South America and shea butter production in Ghana. They’ve been out to Sumatra, too, because we were very concerned about palm oil. The land is being sucked up by big multinationals that are clear-cut felling and planting palm oil, displacing the local people and the orangutans. The buyers said they could drive for a whole day and not come out of the palm plant plantations. It was the sheer scale of it -- we came back from Sumatra and decided we didn’t want anything to do with palm oil. We’re trialling our first palm-free soap at the moment -- it’s called Greenwash.
SP: Could you say roughly how much of your range is currently organic?
HJ: It’s hard to say, but our fruit and veg suppliers are on a remit of getting as much organic as they can. I think it runs at about 60 per cent, but this varies through the year. We know it’s more air miles as a lot of these organic ingredients are being grown abroad, but we think that -- offset against transport costs -- organic production is best overall. We also have the complication that we have lots and lots of essential oils and there aren’t that many organic essential oils available. But we’re working with the Soil Association with a view to getting a couple of products certified organic.
SP: Your site refers to vegan products and how they’re increasingly important to you. Do you get the impression that a lot of your shoppers are vegan?
HJ: I would say that most vegans in Britain know us and shop with us, so we do have to take this factor into account. If we can make a top-quality product whilst eliminating all the non-vegan ingredients then we will. We refuse to use animal ingredients, but about 76 per cent of our products happen to be vegan, too. There are some conditioners that we put lanolin in, though, some face products that we have beeswax in and some ingredients for certain hair and skin types where non-vegan ingredients are necessary.
SP: So what’s your policy on packaging as a company? Do you encourage re-use?
HJ: We go for the traditional reduce, reuse, recycle model. We set ourselves the primary goal of reducing, I think about 70 per cent of our products in the shops are unpackaged. We stock a solid shampoo bar that requires no packaging, so every time you buy one you save three plastic bottles because it gives you the equivalent washes of three bottles of shampoo. We’re also hoping to start doing refillable fragrances, and in January we’re introducing a new line of plastic bottles and plastic pots, which are 100 per cent post-consumer waste. This will mean 95 per cent of all the packaging we use will be recycled -- and recyclable.
SP: What other ethical beauty brands do you personally admire, from an ethical point of view?
HJ: You’re asking the wrong person! I’ve been vegan for 21 years and I really struggle to find things that I’m willing to give my money to, so my message would be for people to cut down consumption. The companies that I admire are the small companies that haven’t had to make compromises, that are sticking to their guns -- like Bio-D, Green People, and Weleda. The Body Shop-L’Oreal thing is the ultimate contradiction -- it’s not a route that we’ve gone down even though we’ve had offers, because for us the ethics were the core of every decision. Certainly people like me have said right from day one that we would leave if that happened.
SP: My final question is just about the smell of your stores. They smell, well…the opposite of natural! Why's that?
HJ: That’s because we’ve done away with packaging so the smell is free to escape. We use predominantly essential oils, whereas most products are much more heavily fragranced than ours because they’ve got very strong aroma chemicals in them. If you walked into Boots and all their packaging was gone it would smell a lot stronger -- and a lot more synthetic -- than our shops!
31 October 2007 11:53am
Hi
I just wanted to comment on Lush's new palm-free soap called Green Wash.
Although I do believe that it is "Green" in marketing terms simply having a look at the ingredients it sort of smacks of toxins:
According to Lush the ingredients list is as follows:
Water (Aqua) , Propylene Glycol , Sodium Rapeseedate , Sodium Sunflowerate , Sodium Cocoate , Perfume , Sodium Stearate , Sodium Lauryl Sulfate , Soya Flour (Glycine soja) , Oakmoss Absolute (Evernia prunastri) , Frankincense Oil (Boswellia carterii) , Glycerine , Sodium Chloride , EDTA , Tetrasodium Editronate , *Limonene , Gardenia Extract (Gardenia jasminoides) , Chlorophyllin , Green Glitter (Polyethylene terephthalate)
* Occurs naturally in essential oils.
Isn't Propylene glycol, also known as propane-1,2-diol?
Isn't Propylene glycol toxic and used in car anti-freeze?
There's also Sodium Lauryl Sulfate, EDTA are these not questionable ingredients to add to a soap?
I know many soap makers that manufacture hand made cold process soap the old fashioned way and they don't need to add SLS or Propylene glycol or EDTAs so why do Lush - is this what you call Green or even Smart?
The mind boggles..
At any rate, thank you for the informative interview!
regards
Lin
01 November 2007 06:46pm
I agree Linda. I know a little about this (running my own 'natural' skincare company). Although I applaud the 'palm free' approach, I am concerned (like you) with a few ingredients listed:
SLS is one of the anionic surfactants which are contaminated with nitrosamines (which cause cancer in animals); EDTA (ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid) is non bio-degradable; Tetrasodium Editronate is a chemical used as a water softener in soaps and prevents scum; Propylene Glycol is one of those ingredients that can be classed as an organic compound ie 'natural' because it contains carbon (as all living matter does). In fact it is a petroleum derivative and is potentially toxic and Polyethylene terephthalate (or PET) is predominantly used to produce plastic bottles. (Personally I don't know what 'glitter' adds this 'green product'.
20 November 2007 10:51pm
It's hilarious and unfortunate that the new soap is called "Greenwash"... if only they knew what a bad term that is in the green industry!
24 November 2007 12:40pm
It is a remarkable and landmark decision for Lush to avoid palm oil in all its products...something no other major cosmetics or skin care company has been able to commit to yet. While we, The Borneo Orangutan Survival (BOS) Foundation UK, sit on the Roundtable on Sustainable Palm Oil in the effort to promote that what palm oil is produced will someday be produced more sustainably, we certainly feel the best solution would be to not use palm oil altogether. However, for consumers it is so difficult for them to choose products without palm oil or its derivatives. Vague labeling as vegetable oil does not help, and for every day consumers to be educated about all the names that palm oil can be described as , especially in beauty care products, is a tall order. And to expect consumers to read through ingredients labels on so many products is unrealistic. Therefore, I feel Lush have done an amazing thing by making it as simple as possible for the consumer to know that they have not been made unwitting participants in what can only be called the genocide of one of our nearest cousins: the orangutan.
Thank you, Lush, for doing your bit!
Michelle Desilets
Founder and Executive Director
Borneo Orangutan Survival Foundation UK
29 November 2007 10:13am
Hey Jen - I think it's meant with a wink in the eye and a bit of irony! That was the impression I got from chatting to them.
18 December 2007 12:10pm
Hello Smart Planet readers, it?s Sean from LUSH here. I just wanted to post a quick response to some of the comments that you have been making. First of all?thank you for your thoughts, it?s always invaluable to get feedback on the work we are doing, especially from ?greens? like yourselves. I think you?d be surprised over how much we take these types of comments on board.
About the ingredients that LUSH use:
As you may be aware all of our products are made with a majority of fresh and natural ingredients. We use safe synthetic materials to support the natural ingredients we love to use which have such good effects for the skin and hair. We choose our synthetic materials very carefully and they are usually chosen because of their long safety record and history of use. This is based not only on over 20 years of use by our creative team, various reports from respected chemical experts, but also the fact that any information sometimes written for public consumption is based only on supposition and out of date animal tests. We use them at a minimum. For instance, approximately 75% of our products do not contain synthetic preservatives, which is why you?ll see a ?use by? date sticker on products. They are made with fresh ingredients and are either not preserved, or minimally preserved, so they have a self-life of 12 to 14 months.
About specific ingredients:
Sodium Laurel Sulphate, like any cleaning agent used in industrial situations, can be dangerous in large quantities. When we use them, however, they are heavily diluted and modified into a safe dose. Even though we feel the science indicates that SLS is a safe cosmetics ingredient, we have been listening to our customers and have looked into developing products without it. Our ?squeaky green? solid shampoo bar is a good example: http://www.lush.co.uk/products/Squeaky_Green_2827.aspx
Propylene Glycol has hundreds of uses, from cosmetics to food to anti-freeze (it is now being used in anti-freeze because it much safer than the toxic alternative, ethylene glycol). Because this ingredient is so widely used, volumes of studies have been done on it and Lush feels absolutely confident it is safe for human use. Just because it is an ingredient in anti-freeze doesn?t make it bad?water is also used in anti-freeze. We use propylene glycol because it is a fantastic moisturizer and helps deliver our fresh, natural ingredients to your skin.
EDTA. Lush is currently reviewing our use of EDTA, please visit www.lush.co.uk to keep updated on this.
10 February 2008 09:10pm
Lush clearly state that they are not 100% natural and that any synthetic they use is SAFE. Not that they use no synthetics...
13 May 2008 05:39pm
Hilary Jones you seriously need to do some research about your own products. then find out why you need those indredents and the do an interview where you can bring up the conserns that we have about your products ok? geeze i never thought that i would ever have to say that to someone. i always thought people were smart, but you proved me wrong.
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Discover the brilliant experienced people who are helping SmartPlanet through the green and ethical minefield.
