I completely agree that punitive taxes has been the mantra of the green movement for decades.
My biggest problem with punitive taxes is that making fossil fuels more expensive through punitive taxes mostly punishes the average citizens who are just trying to survive. The cost of everything from heat to food goes up, driving more people into poverty.
Several years ago the New England area states established a regional tax on electricity allegedly to help provide funding to promote renewable energy. Hundreds of millions in taxes have been collected in the years since. It was just over $15 of my $48 electric bill last month. Over 30%.
After months of research it turns out not a single dime of the taxes collected has been spent directly on renewable energy as promised. Every state puts the money into their general fund. The combined renewable energy funding from all of the states general funds is far below the amount of taxes collected. So that argument fails too justify the tax. The money is being spent in ways the taxpayers never agreed to when the laws were passed with little opposition.
Your proposals make sense. Which is sadly why they will likely never happen.
Discussion on:
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Rated
Rated
Thank you.
Posted by Hates Idiots
14th Nov
Just
In
In
Yes to carbon tax with payroll tax offset.
Posted by laffsonmee
20th Dec
Show:
+5
Votes
Thank you.
Posted by Hates Idiots
14th Nov
0
Votes
not with a proper carbon tax
A carbon tax that offsets the payroll tax increases tax on carbon while decreases tax on labor by an equal amount. This is the way to go, and increases in some prices are offset by decreases in other prices.
Posted by Brouse_invest@...
16th Nov
0
Votes
Message to Editor - Error?
"In order to pay for the FiTs, an assessment would be levied on all consumers utility bills, just like the charges we currently pay for things like , and so on."
Editor - There appears to be a missing word that should appear after the word "like" and before the third comma in the above sentence. (From the 11th paragraph below the "Pitch a FiT" boldfaced subheader in the above article.)
Editor - There appears to be a missing word that should appear after the word "like" and before the third comma in the above sentence. (From the 11th paragraph below the "Pitch a FiT" boldfaced subheader in the above article.)
Posted by Dov Todd
Updated - 14th Nov
+1
Vote
Fixed
Thanks Dov. I don't know what happened there - had some trouble with the publishing system. Fixed now.
Posted by Chris Nelder
14th Nov
0
Votes
Great post!
Although my pseudonym does not show it, I am one of the green ones and I must say your article absolutely rocks! The way shown by Germany is the most sensible one, as results are proving!
Your proposal to cut around congress is brilliant and together with all your other great insights I'm obliged to shout out: "CHRIS NELDER FOR PRESIDENT 2016!!!"
Your proposal to cut around congress is brilliant and together with all your other great insights I'm obliged to shout out: "CHRIS NELDER FOR PRESIDENT 2016!!!"
Posted by cash365
14th Nov
+3
Votes
the way shown by German coal consumption?
Germany is lovingly supporting the American coal industry, by importing and burning our coal in larger numbers. They are building new coal plants, and increasing consumption of the ones they have.
Is this the sensible policy you refer to?
Is this the sensible policy you refer to?
Posted by James.McMurtry
Updated - 14th Nov
+1
Vote
25 percent of Germanys electricity now comes from renewable sources
Yeah, right, James, thanks for the heads up!
I meant that the policy of Germany considering RENEWABLE energy is sensible because "Thanks to its FiT, 25 percent of Germanys electricity now comes from solar, wind and biomass."
But speaking of Germany's overall policy you are right:
It is considered that Germany will shut down it's last nuclear facility in 2021, which explains why they are switching back to coal. But what do you hate more: CO2 or radiation? I agree with you that this coal policy is not sensible at all, because coal plants pollute twice as much than gas plants. I doubt Germany will accomplish it's emmission goals (40 percent less CO2 in 2020) acting like this, Maybe there still need to be bigger carrots shown to the german investors in order not to invest in dirty coal plants and go renewable instead?
I meant that the policy of Germany considering RENEWABLE energy is sensible because "Thanks to its FiT, 25 percent of Germanys electricity now comes from solar, wind and biomass."
But speaking of Germany's overall policy you are right:
It is considered that Germany will shut down it's last nuclear facility in 2021, which explains why they are switching back to coal. But what do you hate more: CO2 or radiation? I agree with you that this coal policy is not sensible at all, because coal plants pollute twice as much than gas plants. I doubt Germany will accomplish it's emmission goals (40 percent less CO2 in 2020) acting like this, Maybe there still need to be bigger carrots shown to the german investors in order not to invest in dirty coal plants and go renewable instead?
Posted by cash365
14th Nov
+1
Vote
CO2 or radiation
Well, I prefer neither, as demonstrated by the American, French and German nuclear power industries. They emit neither radiation nor CO2.
But in reality the US energy policy will be "drill baby drill", for shale gas. That is clearly what Obama is pursuing, with some (not a lot) of subsidies for renewables.
But in reality the US energy policy will be "drill baby drill", for shale gas. That is clearly what Obama is pursuing, with some (not a lot) of subsidies for renewables.
Posted by James.McMurtry
Updated - 14th Nov
-1
Votes
Germany not switching to coal
Posted by todiane4@...
15th Nov
0
Votes
german coal consumption
it is coal consumption that counts, and in germany, coal consumption is going up, despite it's FiT
Posted by James.McMurtry
19th Nov
0
Votes
At least you have to give Germany credit for having a backup plan...
...as opposed to jumping blindly into the eco-abyss as they'd have us do here.
Posted by JohnMcGrew@...
15th Nov
-1
Votes
Re: cutting around Congress
Thank you for pointing this out so succinctly. Personally, I am sick and tired of various parts of the executive and jucicial branches "cutting around Congress". It is an unconstitutional endangerment of our liberty, regardless of intent.
Posted by dmm99
14th Nov
+2
Votes
Taxation without representation
All of those "assessments" on our utility bills are TAXES under a pseudonym. Since they are seldom authorized by legislatures, most of them violate either the state or federal constitution. Our rights are being taken away, assessment by assessment, fine by fine, ticket by ticket, fee by fee. Those still above the poverty line are being systematically robbed, driven into dependence on the government, so they can be controlled from the top. FIGHT NOW, WHILE YOU HAVE THE CHANCE.
Posted by dmm99
14th Nov
-2
Votes
Chris Nelder needs money
Mr. Nelder badly mistimed the renewable energy market, and he needs taxpayer dollars to save his investments. That is the point of this blog entry, and many others.
Posted by James.McMurtry
14th Nov
-1
Votes
Carbon tax better
I agree, a carbon tax offset by payroll tax reduction is a better approach. That lets the economic system then determine winners and losers. But we need the carbon tax so polluters pay to use the atmosphere as a dumping ground.
Posted by Brouse_invest@...
16th Nov
0
Votes
Taxation without representation. Uh did you miss the Tuesday before last??
We had a couple of elections here in the USA on November 6th. People voted. We had winners and lossers. If your canidates lost, you should work harder to get your canidates elected next time.
But don't say that you don't have representation.
But don't say that you don't have representation.
Posted by mfinca
17th Nov
+3
Votes
Natural Gas
It's all about electricity, and yet natural gas gets ignored.
Natural gas is our clean ~ Bridge fuel to renewable energy.
And natural gas power plants designed right can be near 100% Energy Efficient.
Cool exhaust instead of hot & greatly reduced emissions.
Natural gas is our clean ~ Bridge fuel to renewable energy.
And natural gas power plants designed right can be near 100% Energy Efficient.
Cool exhaust instead of hot & greatly reduced emissions.
Posted by Sid Abma
14th Nov
+1
Vote
Natural Gas
Coal has recently dropped from producing 50% of our electricity to 40% due to displacement by, currently cheap, natural gas.
The maximum efficiency for new natural gas plants runs about 60%.
The maximum efficiency for new natural gas plants runs about 60%.
Posted by mfinca
17th Nov
+3
Votes
Lack of fairness in the approach on topic...
When the author starts out with the labels which tend to demonize one side of the argument, the entire argument and the author lose credibility.
Why did the author feel the need to label the opposition as "the right wing"? Here's the sentence:
"Right-wing groups are already mustering their opposition to it."
Wouldn't it be just as "fair" to label the proponents of carbon taxes as "left wing"? How about referring to the "global warming/climate change" proponents as "environmental wackos"? Would that be fair, or are the demeaning/polarizing labels only applicable to the "right wing"?
The way I see it myself, it's the environment movement which has no real science behind it, and all they have is an agenda, which is to hand over more power to government over our daily lives. That is where the radical agenda exists.
Why did the author feel the need to label the opposition as "the right wing"? Here's the sentence:
"Right-wing groups are already mustering their opposition to it."
Wouldn't it be just as "fair" to label the proponents of carbon taxes as "left wing"? How about referring to the "global warming/climate change" proponents as "environmental wackos"? Would that be fair, or are the demeaning/polarizing labels only applicable to the "right wing"?
The way I see it myself, it's the environment movement which has no real science behind it, and all they have is an agenda, which is to hand over more power to government over our daily lives. That is where the radical agenda exists.
Posted by adornoe
14th Nov
0
Votes
not right vs left
i agree. FIT vs carbon tax is a technical issue and not right vs left. Carbon tax is a better approach, in my opinion.
Posted by Brouse_invest@...
16th Nov
-1
Votes
RE: Needs Money
Gore must have a cash flow problem, he's back at it again too...
Posted by GregGold
14th Nov
-1
Votes
no Gore diversified
Gore has a wide diversity of investments.
You can see that Nelder has been flogging the "renewable investment angle" for some time.
http://www.amazon.com/Investing-Renewable-Energy-Making-Stocks/dp/0470152680/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1352932680&sr=8-1&keywords=chris+nelder
You think this doesn't make his FIT idea compromised? He's advocating a massive federal tax that would benefit his investments personally. An ethical person would include a disclaimer, he does not.
You can see that Nelder has been flogging the "renewable investment angle" for some time.
http://www.amazon.com/Investing-Renewable-Energy-Making-Stocks/dp/0470152680/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1352932680&sr=8-1&keywords=chris+nelder
You think this doesn't make his FIT idea compromised? He's advocating a massive federal tax that would benefit his investments personally. An ethical person would include a disclaimer, he does not.
Posted by James.McMurtry
14th Nov
+1
Vote
The moral component of eco-capitalism mitigates the need for doing so...
...or so it seems.
Posted by JohnMcGrew@...
15th Nov
-2
Votes
Gore has been at it.
Believe me, Gore has been spending a lot of his money on this, and is not making money on this is all. He has also been at it all along, but press coverage comes and goes. So you just havent been paying attention.
Posted by Brouse_invest@...
16th Nov
0
Votes
FIT - the obvious solution
Chris - you are spot on. FIT is the way to go - it is the fastest way, the cheapest way and the ONLY time proven method of accelerating renewables. - it will happen - I just hope soon.
Link to a FIT White Paper for anyone to use and or pass around....
http://www.principalsolarinstitute.org/uploads/custom/3/_documents/Feed-In_Tariffs.pdf
Link to a FIT White Paper for anyone to use and or pass around....
http://www.principalsolarinstitute.org/uploads/custom/3/_documents/Feed-In_Tariffs.pdf
Posted by solarpete
14th Nov